Jeffrey Steel posts the response of Bishop Haverland to the Apostolic Constitution. Bp. Haverland is from the Anglican Catholic Church--one of the many schismatic Anglican 'continuing' churches in the US. I'm afraid it doesn't make very encouraging reading. The Bishop basically says, "Whaat? You mean the Pope wants us to treat him like the Pope? Ya gotta be kidding! We're Catholic already! Who needs a Pope?"
Of course the reply is, "Either have one Pope or ten thousand." Bishop Haverland should be honest and drop the name 'Catholic' from his church's title.
Tuesday, November 10, 2009
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
14 comments:
This shouldn't be surprising. A desire for closer ties with Rome was one of the important factors that led to the schism in the group that separated from the Episcopal church after the 1976 ordination of Women. The ACC was the group most hostile to Rome as I recall. I think they settled into three bodies with some independents. I was waylaid in the ACC for a while before my conversion about ten years ago.
He's his own "pope"
Heard you on podcast from the other day, Father. It was helpful, even if too brief to cover the many faces of Anglicanism.
Oh, these priests, you just can’t trust them, one minute they offer you a nice bit of cold turkey and the next… ;)
I’m very glad you’re writing about this because all the Anglicans I know whether on or off Ol’ Beardie’s Christmas card list are being very tight-lipped. It’s as if they’ve been given the moon and are thinking, “Oh, rats, now what do we do with it?” but as an ex-Anglican I am very interested and my curiosity would have starved to death if not for this blog.
Instaurare is absolutely right about the ACC. They were always prickly and anti-Roman and had a wee touch of the vagans mentality excommunicating eachother and anyone else (and her cat) who ruffled them.
I can't speak for any of the past experiences others have had, but I have found only increasing unity in the ACC and the wider continuum. There's a lot of Grace to be found, especially in the international church; our one bishop in the Diocese of Sudan must visit his parishes on a bicycle. In a newly formed Diocese along the Eastern Cape of South Africa, the indigenous tribe represented there will have their first bishop ever since the area was Christianized 100 years ago.
So far as claims to the title "Catholic" go, it isn't even in the official Latin name of the Roman Catholic Church, and so I fail to see why Rome has a monopoly on such things.
I enjoy reading your Blog and lots to ponder on.
A word to the Most Reverend Mark Haverland of the Anglican Catholic Church: Your community should in no way be regarded as en par with the Orthodox Churches who are rightfully regarded as Sister Churches to the Catholic Church, many of direct Apostolic Origin. Canterbury was always - at least until the schism - a dependent see of Patriarchate of Rome, pure and simple. That the Pope has generously opened the canonical doors to all Anglicans who desire to enter the pleroma of Catholic communion, retaining most of their traditions, is a generous accommodation, so please spare us your whining and claims of absorption, the loss of trusteeship, and a tacit acknowledgment of the problematic nature of most (not all) Anglican orders.
Shaughn,
I do hope and pray that many of the ACC parishes decide to accept this generous offer, in spite of their leadership. However, there are sections of the ACC that are fighting this tooth and nail. For example, I cannot look away from the ongoing spectacle at the "Anglican Continuum" blog:
http://anglicancontinuum.blogspot.com/
There has been so much venom and nastiness coming from there it is a wonder how any dispassionate observer could want to be a part of it.
The point is that the self-described Anglo-Catholics that want no part of larger unity are now experiencing an identity crisis.
They see many of their comrades happy and excited by this development, and are working overtime to convince them not to do it - `it is a bad thing, you will lose everything, your Anglican identity is worthless', and many more horrid things that I will not reproduce here. I can't believe they really believe it themselves, but it seems to be their coping mechanism.
It is important that there are blogs like Fr. Longenecker that will write the truth about this; how it is indeed wonderful, exciting, and the answer to many of our (and out ancestor's) prayers.
I do in fact worry about these guys: Every time there is a public announcement that yet another Anglican group has signed up over the next two+ years will these folks continue to go into conniption fits?
It is also interesting that even the explicitly protestant Anglicans have enough distance and charity to recognize that this is a good thing for those that asked for it; see e.g. Matt Kennedy's piece:
http://www.standfirminfaith.com/index.php/sf/page/24900/
Andrew,
I hope in your reading the Continuum you've found that I've been insisting repeatedly that the folks there let it go and focus instead on serving the Church.
But, of course, some folks think that the proper way to serve the church is to keep arguing, rather than logging out of their computer and talking with people about Christ, the Church, and the good things Anglicanism has to offer.
I am Not Happy with the tone over there at present. Archbishop Haverland has consistently said that folks who can be Roman Catholic and want to be Roman Catholic should be -- as soon as possible, even. But a lot of Anglicanoids (a technical term) aren't nearly so charitable.
Church of England Bishop John Broadhurst has summed it up - "For some of us I suspect our bluff is called!"
For years Anglo Catholoics have been claiming to be part of the Catholic Church. Now they are being given a chance to prove it.
Just watch many of them run a mile!
As I said before, many Anglicans love being their own popes. Their pride will prevent them from taking up the Pope's incredibly generous offer.
For the really genuine searchers in the Anglican Church now is the time to come home.
Shaughn,
You write: "Archbishop Haverland has consistently said that folks who can be Roman Catholic and want to be Roman Catholic should be -- as soon as possible, even."
I am already weary of this. The fact is that the pope has just given the Anglican Catholics - understood in the historical sense of the phrase - everything we have ever dreamed of. To say otherwise is to look a gift-horse in the mouth.
We can now be Catholic Anglicans in full communion with the Roman Catholic church, espousing our common Catholic faith, keeping our liturgy in the Anglican tradition. We have an astonishing amount of honor given to our now famous Anglican Patrimony in the Apostolic Constitution. This is the future! I think not only of myself, but of my children and their children. Do not be afraid.
Archbishop Haverland says everything he needs to say in this line from his statement: "...persons already convinced of the truth of Roman Catholic teaching in its fullness should become Roman Catholics promptly with or without the Pastoral Provision, with or without a liturgical "Anglican Use," and with or without the new Ordinariates." Amen, Archbishop Haverland.
This statement by Archbishop Haverland hits at the heart of the Anglican conversions matter "...persons already convinced of the truth of Roman Catholic teaching in its fullness should become Roman Catholics promptly with or without the Pastoral Provision, with or without a liturgical "Anglican Use," and with or without the new Ordinariates." Amen to that, Archbishop Haverland!
It seems so calm here. Totally unlike the atmosphere of venom and rage that I experienced as a student at CUA in 2005 when Cardinal Ratzinger was elected pope.
You RCs are in the middle of a civil war, and the RC left wingers here in America are wining. I don't care to be inside the Alamo you have fortified when the opposition sweeps over you. We were dispossessed thirty years ago by the left of the Episcopal Church, never again!
Be honest with yourselves, you are only one bad pope away from being in the same boat as the Episcopal Church.
"Be honest with yourselves, you are only one bad pope away from being in the same boat as the Episcopal Church."
Sorry Father - not true!
The Catholic Church, founded with Peter as it's rock on earth, was given the explicit promise of Our Blessed Lord that "the gates of Hell will not prevail against it".
The trendy Catholics can rant all they like but they will not destroy the Church.
Your retreat out of the Episcopal Church into yet another man made denomination (one of literally hundreds of ex-Anglican enclaves) will ultimately avail you nothing. These enclaves are fighting among themselves and all failing to recognise the One Church that Christ founded. It's just Protestantism continued.
With all its sinners and traitors the Catholic Church is God's Church.
Post a Comment